randomWalks

You know better than this when you say it: The intended effect of RPI is to make it nearly impossible to compile evidence of the existence of racism

The intended effect of RPI is to attempt to take race out of public function. If there is some evidence of racial abuse by someone, then bring it in an appropriate forum. But you simply insist that some broad statistics showing that black folks aren't keeping up somehow proves white racism. It does not.

The racial spoils system is crumbling down, pal. Tough noogies.

The racial spoils system is crumbling down, pal. Tough noogies.

So, now a quarter of the white population can expect to go to prison? Sweet!

Barger, please!

You hardly deserve a response to yr comment, but I have to ask. When you say "black folks aren't keeping up", tell me...why do you suppose that is? How is that supposed to be interpreted?

perhapse you could interperate it thusly.

that african americans have the lowest test scores and highest instances of arrest for violence of any race in america and would rather blame that on inequality and predjudice testing and rampant racisim than on a subculture of music, movies, and other entertainments that glorifies ignorance and celebrates the rewards of crime and violence. i'm sure that now i'm a racist for even pointing out that mass media geared tward the african american demographic send the same messages over and over; that violence is the only way to gain respect, that money is the only thing in life worth haveing and must be had in abundance and gotten by any means nessisary, that learning is counter-productive, that women exist only for the pleasure of men and by extention to have and raise thier children. and that this media is created, produced and sometimes even distributed by african americans.

maybe you could interpret it that way?

Themes of violence, greed and misogyny are in no way unique to media targeted at blacks. It's exceedingly rare that black people have the opportunity to create, approve, produce, and distribute their own media. Spike Lee (sexist) can come close to doing all of that. Perhaps you have some counter examples?

Re: low test scores, it's been demonstrated repeatedly that external and internalized expectations have a huge effect on test performance and general success. Re: arrests for violence, I'm not about to argue statistics, but when law enforcement is selectively applied to certain communities that's what you get. The justice system is all fucked up from death row down to racial profiling on the New Jersey turnpike and even John Ashcroft has admitted that.

You're right, your prejudice is showing. Do you really want to get into this?

Yes the justice system is baised. Yes the playing field is not even and many

poor people have no reasonable expectation to move beyond their current

social and economic sphere. However, if you think there is not a 'bling-

bling' factor in today's african american culture, then you need to get out

more. If you say people internalize external expections then you have to

agree that the same people are also suspectible to the mass media thrown at

them. And some of that media is created by black artists. Even if it is

distributed and produced by other races, there are black artists promoting

violence and money. Why is it racist to admit that and admit it has an

effect? Personally I think it is more racist to say this culture doesn't

exist than to say it does. To blame everything on a prejudice culture is

racist. Yes racism and prejudice should be blamed but we need to allow all

factors to be considered and all reasons to be blamed, not just the ones that

mesh best with liberal ideology.

No one argued there is not a "bling-bling" factor in African-American culture. It's not racist to say so. It is racist, however, to blame crime among blacks on such a thing while ignoring other, more pervasive factors. It paints blacks as unthinking dupes, unable to make their own choices between "good" and "bad" messages. It ignores the positive messages of black artists, musicians and writers that are plentiful and equally accessible to blacks (and all other people). And it puts the cart before the horse--I think you'd find that poverty and racism, not the media, are the real root causes of crime. Media may suggest ways out, but can't rightly take the blame for the problem.

I was not asking for other factors to be ignored. I was just saying all factors should be considered. When discussing sexism the impact of the mass media is always brought up, does that make women stupid? Whether we like it or not, mass media impacts what people think. That does not make them stupid...it just makes them part of society. Poverty is a root of crime and racism helps keep some of the african american community impoverished. However I disagree with your cart before the horse theory. Racism has many causes and one of the 'roots' of racism is sterotyping. If the mass media pushes these stereotypes and black artists continue to create those stereotypes, they are just helping sustain racism. I wish it were as simple as one root problem but my point is you have to address all the causes. I am not saying that African americans are any more dupes than any other community but all communities are impacted by mass media and if images of violence are pervasive in media targeted towards blacks, it will have an impact. That's what media does.

It seems to me that blacks are more commonly associated with violence in media such as the nightly news or "mass-market" (targeted at a white audience) movies and tv shows than anywhere else. This of course creates the association in the mind of the white majority, which then plays out as police brutality and unequal sentencing and on and on. Hip hop videos have been primarily about cars, wristwatches, and alcohol for the last 8 years or so. What exactly are we talking about here?

b-dog, I was thinking more of j's comment than yours -- it emphasized media (wrongly, I believe) over testing, inequality and other prejudices.

I stand by my cart/horse theory. Media never makes anyone commit a crime. At the most, it suggests courses of action. I believe other racist conditions in our society are to blame for putting blacks in situations in which crime seems like an attractive option. Any effect the media has is negligible by comparison.

However, the media's influence on whites in perpetrating stereotypes is of great influence -- but that's another discussion.

Dang, make that "Media never make..." I hate that.

However, the media's influence on whites in perpetrating stereotypes is of great influence -- but that's another discussion.

I actually think it ought to be central to this one.

Well, make it so! I was focusing on the media's influence on black audiences, since that was the meat of the original point made, but that doesn't have to limit things.